Mark Smith and Raymond Gerber, former competitors turned co-founders of the Institute for Journey Management, join Jochem van der Veer to unpack how enterprise CX is evolving in the age of AI. Drawing on decades of experience across Kitewheel and Thunderhead, they explore how journey orchestration is being reshaped by generative AI and organizational transformation.

At the center is a key tension: AI enables scale and personalization, but without journey context and operational alignment, it risks amplifying broken experiences. The conversation reveals why journey context is no longer just a customer-facing construct, but a critical internal capability for aligning decisions, breaking silos, and enabling truly adaptive, value-driven CX.

Guest Bio

Mark Smith is a pioneer in customer analytics and journey orchestration, with over 30 years of experience in predictive modeling and customer engagement. He founded Kitewheel and led it to become a market leader in journey orchestration. His work has consistently focused on aligning data-driven decisioning with business constraints and customer value. He now co-leads the Institute for Journey Management.

Raymond Gerber is a leading voice in journey orchestration and enterprise CX, with multiple patents in the field. As former CEO of Thunderhead, he helped shape the category before its acquisition by Medallia. His expertise spans AI, decisioning systems, and operating model design. He is now focused on advancing journey-centric transformation through the Institute for Journey Management.

Key Takeaways

– Journey context is multi-dimensional, combining temporal, situational, directional, and constraint-based elements that guide both AI decisions and business actions

– Generative AI shifts value from prediction to prescription, enabling continuous, closed-loop learning driven by real-time customer intent

– Internal alignment is the real bottleneck, journey context matters more inside the organization than for customers who simply “live” the experience

– Hyper-personalization evolves from static next-best actions to dynamic, conversational interactions powered by structured and unstructured data fusion

– Journey management must evolve from project-based initiatives to an embedded operating model tied to value exchange between customer and business

Chapters

00:00 Why journey context matters for AI agents and workflows

00:03 Defining customer journey context in enterprise CX

00:08 AI in customer experience and the shift to non-deterministic journeys

00:12 Hyper-personalization and next best action evolution

00:15 Breaking down silos with shared journey context

00:19 Structured vs unstructured data in journey orchestration

00:23 Internal alignment and journey management strategy

00:28 Journey-centric operating model vs project mindset

00:33 Predictive vs prescriptive AI in customer experience

00:38 Enterprise CX transformation and journey-led value management

LinkedIn Profiles

Guests: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mapsmith/https://www.linkedin.com/in/golfergerbs/Jochem van der Veer: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jochemvanderveer/

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