What can studying perspective taking tell us about relationships, dating violence, and the experiences of neurodivergent people?

In this episode, Ben sits down with Ashley Rodrigues, a graduate student in Western University’s School and Applied Child Psychology program and lab manager with the Living Organisms Learning Lab. Ashley describes how her early experiences seeking mental-health support helped shape her interest in psychology, school-based services, and research with neurodivergent people. 

The conversation centres on Ashley’s research examining perspective taking and dating-violence-related outcomes among post-secondary students with ADHD, autism, and neurotypical participants. She explains emotional perspective taking through a Relational Frame Theory lens and describes how the study moves beyond self-report by using a behavioural perspective-taking task. 

Ashley also walks Ben through the evolving findings from the project and some important cautions around interpreting differences between groups. They discuss social communication, working memory, social desirability, masking, literal interpretation of questions, heterogeneity within autism, and the possibility that measurement itself can influence apparent differences. 

The conversation becomes personal as Ashley discusses being diagnosed with both ADHD and autism at age 22 following earlier explanations centred on anxiety and related concerns. She and Ben explore what lived experience can bring to clinical relationships and research, particularly when people’s experiences do not fit conventional expectations of how neurodivergence presents. 

Finally, Ashley shares what happened when she presented this work very early in her graduate career at an Ontario behaviour analysis conference. What began with uncertainty about whether she belonged turned into productive interdisciplinary conversations and a poster award. 

Contact Ashley

https://www.linkedin.com/in/ashleyvrod/

Links

Living Organisms Lab

https://www.livingorganismslearninglab.ca/

For another perspective on autism, relationships, and interpersonal violence, listen to my conversation with Amy Pearson about autistic lived experience, masking, relationships, and her research into intimate partner violence and abuse. 

🎧 The Hidden Cost of Masking: Autism, Identity and Authenticity with Dr. Amy Pearson